Practical Access Podcast

S:2 E:4: Practical Access Self-Advocacy Skills

May 06, 2020 Season 2 Episode 4
Practical Access Podcast
S:2 E:4: Practical Access Self-Advocacy Skills
Show Notes Transcript

Drs. Rebecca Hines and Lisa Dieker, UCF Faculty members, share their thoughts self-advocacy.   This podcast was recorded on Dr. Hines' birthday so listen to learn about what she wanted to be when she grew up.  In this episode the team discuss the importance of knowing one's strengths and weaknesses along with looking for development benchmarks in peers. They share big and small practical ideas for parents and teachers to support students with disabilities in being their own advocates. Remember questions can be shared on Twitter @accesspractical.  Follow us on itunes or iheart podcasts. 

spk_0:   0:04
welcome to practical access. I'm  Lisa Dieker, and I'm

spk_1:   0:09
Rebecca Hines and Lisa today  since it's my birthday, your present to me is gonna be taking the lead on today's

spk_0:   0:17
topic. Well, since it's your birthday, I thought I might start with a little humor. So are you ready for a question? I get way. I wanted to know when you were in third or fourth grade. What did you want to be when

spk_1:   0:28
you were going to grow up? I hate to sound PSA. Oh, blase. But I always wanted to be a teacher. Last that's a good bye. I just way literally. We were. So I had I had done a lot of reading for some reason. about colonial times and okay,  slow. Instead of playing school, we played colonial times in our playhouse, and I had a big ruler and I would hit my brothers and sisters on the knuckles with them. And while other kids were playing things, I was playing colonial time. So I guess I wanted to be a mean teacher,

spk_0:   1:06
that somebody Well, I guess that's that's funny, cause that's what I wanted to be growing up. Actually, I want to be a special ed teacher. But,I wasn't a very good speller. And I think in first grade I learned to advocate for myself, which is kind of a topic I want to talk about today.  I made a poster that said, When I grow up, I want to be a teacher for people who are blind and deaf and made fun of me and said And my mother is still remember She said, Lisa, you get on that bus and you tell people if you can teach dead people, your veteran, anybody on that bus I think that's that's where myself ever to see was born. And so it's something We both wanted to be teachers. But that's kind of the way we were in. We were asked about, you know, how do you teach Self Africa thieves? I think you have to go naturally where kids are at, and it's funny because I do say you decide your career by the fifth or sixth grade and so I think my first point or thought about self have exceed is helping kids be whatever they want to be. I think one of the favorite Cruz, I've ever heard. If you'll remember one of our past doctor, real students, daughter want to be a garbage dumpster on and should have a disability, she does. That's what she wanted to be. And so I love the fact that they just celebrated. That's what she wanted to get, three. And of course, that changed. She got 456 and and I think we have to listen to what kids enjoy, because I think being the mean teacher with the ruler didn't mean you were gonna be mean. It actually met. You were gonna be a person who managed behaviors I obviously would be. Somebody really wanted to think about those people that were out liars. And so I think, listening to your kids really young, what do they like? What they prefer to me is the first stage itself. Obviously. What do you think, by the way? Having

spk_1:   2:46
I definitely agree listening, listening to to your kids if you're a parent and and if your teacher it does really get back to things that we've talked about before and that idea of choice, you know, if if you've done anything in the pre K level, you're from. You might be familiar with something called high school, which is the framework of how they set up classrooms in such a way that kids go to their preferred area. But only two people are allowed to be in there at a time, and they learn this idea that you go there and you know you take you, take your turn, etcetera. So so early on, these kids are are taught to make make decisions, which is interesting because then we go about the whole lot of times the rest of their academic careers. You no, no, no decisions made. So even though in pre K, we kind of stuck him on that track. So I do think that self advocacy starts with having in a opinion and a decision, because how can I advocate for myself if I don't know what I like and what I want? So I think that we have to empower young people to really start thinking early on, and this is kids of all abilities, you know? What do you love to do? What do you want so that they can learn to articulate that in a way that will help them to get

spk_0:   4:09
it. Yeah, and I think it's equally important to know what you're not good at. Like I am not good. No, not ever having structure in my life again. I've always been a person that I can be creative and I could think outside the box. But then I need to put structure in place to get to through that box, and I think that's the other mistake we make is that we assume only kids with disabilities have deficits. I think everybody has deficits, and I think understanding your strengths and weaknesses. I know our early discussion with Josh shooting white son is you're probably not gonna be an English teacher, son. You got great social skills. But let's not imagine you standing at a board teaching people English goes on. That's your weakness, and you have a strength was physical. My favorite kind of way of thinking about that is as some of Steven Covey's work that I've seen in elementary schools with a program called Leader in Me and if you've ever been in a have ever been in a school leader and Mia's as kind of their core value, I have, I am yeah, and I love the fact that, you know, one of my favorite examples. That kid was running and I still remember my friend. The principal stopped and said the leader many. Why should you not run? I might fall down. Or I might run into someone else of the leader of missions top running. I was like, Where am I? You know, But think about it. Think about that concept for our students, no matter what their age, what do they want to lead themselves to do? Maybe I really do want to get my driver's license. Or maybe I really don't. That's not unusual for kids without disabilities today. Yet I think we have to make assumptions when a kid has a disability, they can't get their license or be we have to push them at 15 and start early. Well, again. I think that's going to be an individual choice. And I think it goes back to that magical word of choice

spk_1:   5:51
when we think about advocating for ourselves. You know, I think as adults it's easy. It's easy to see how that comes into play and everyday life. You call the phone company and they tell you they can't possibly do this or that. And, you know, we find a voice, some of us to say, Oh, well, we will do this. How are we going to make this happen? Um because this has to happen today. I cannot be without money, Internet service. So we're going to make it happen. Let's just talk about how and so is again. You know, I'm an assertive person, so I'm good at that. And in my family, I'm the one that everybody say, Hey, Mom. Hey, Becky, call the phone company because I'm very good advocating for what I need. But you mentioned leader in me. It is tricky to know what part of that we're born with and how people lead us into being that person. So if we're looking at some action items, I would say very concretely, as as appearance or as a teacher, teaching kids to have follow up statements, not just a single statement saying I want juice, you know? And if Mom says, Well, we don't you know, we don't have any juice teaching. What's the next question for kids? You just give up and you don't have anything to drink now. So it's that idea of maybe way talk lease a lot about the idea of grit, and I think that's also tied to self advocacy. This idea of, not taking no for an answer, having having a voice and continuing to hold on to that voice even when you run into obstacles. So pushing through obstacles, I think, is something that we need to work with kids. And a lot of times, at my I mean my own house something what happened because they say, Well, I want to do this and I'll give them one little tiny reason And they'll be like a It's like what you guys, it doesn't mean you can't go to Colombia. It just means that right now there's of obstacles, you know? So it's it's that idea of getting kids to, have the voice, but also to follow through with what it is that they're pursuing.

spk_0:   8:06
Yeah, you know, it's funny that you say that because I think too many times and it's one I always have to work on myself is we need to make sure that we let people period, but people with disabilities speak for themselves. Instead of speaking for them. And I think that's another mistake we make very young. Socially, there's multiple siblings in the house, so we'll talk to parents here for a moment. You know, we know some siblings that like to talk for their peers, and that's great. But then how does the peer learn to advocate? And yet, when I think is great, I think in my own personal journey and watching schools, one of the best things I've seen at a young age is letting kids right social stories. But what they're good at month or not, it's a great way for them to write about. You know what? I'm really good. This and I here's a so sure about what's hard for me and not just for disability, but for everybody. But then, for those students with disabilities have giving them that statement of Okay, So if that's hard, what's your solution? Is it technologies that more times phone a friend and then I think collapsing I personally seen in a middle school, is where not only kids exchange student led I. E. P s. I have never seen anything like this where actually students opened the meeting and they had three power point sides. Here's what I'm good at. Here's what I want to work out and here's what I want. I love the statement. I want you people to put on my plan. And I think that's the mistake we've made is that we try to get the general ed in a special ed and the parents own the plan. If the plan for the kid, no matter the age to have a read their plan, have they seen their plan? And honestly, they need to know their plan because you and I both know when they get to college, nobody cares if they don't know now. If students have parents have guardianship, sure, absolutely. You could have shared ownership of that plant. But I still even think kids that their parents have guardianship should know what's on that plan and and to help them. That plan is supposed to get them into life, whatever that might mean. And so I really do think something that says this is my plan and I can speak for myself instead of you always speaking for me

spk_1:   10:04
and even on a smaller scale, scaling it down from that IEP to a daily basis. Sure, if kids went in equipped with a list of you know, here's four supports that I really need to be successful in any class. And they shared that with their teacher or straight with start as a way to advocate for themselves and their supports. Then that's gonna not only eliminate a lot of potential barriers along, you know, this semester of the school year for that student, and it doesn't even matter if it's a really young child. If they can articulate, here's here's the support that I really need to be successful. I assume as a kid can start to ship that kind of information so that it starts the discussion before the school year gets underway and before I'm struggling and before I'm family. So giving kids a voice, I think is critical. Obviously, that's what self advocacy is, and I think that it starts really young, much younger than people would think. And I think if we can even just start weaving in little choices small numbers of things for kids to go and ask for or present to teachers, then later present to the full IEP team. It center. I think that's really where you get started.

spk_0:   11:15
Yeah, and I My last little quick saw it is as a parent, I used to always compare and I don't mean compare in a bad way. But I look on the playground and say, Oh, those kids aren't sucking their thumbs or oh, no one else is running up the slide and throw rocks down eight. And we're now eight, you know? So what is that narrow, typical behavior? Enough that I could make my son have that. But I would always use that as a benchmark to say There are certain things I probably need to think about as a parent, and he didn't ever meet those benchmarks. But if everybody else had a cell phone when they were 12 and I wait until 15 that's okay because my son didn't have the decision making of his peers sometimes. But I use that as kind of a benchmark. What's everybody else around look like? And as a parent, then I would say, All right, well, everybody else's kid can go up in order their own ice cream and user on money. Why am I still standing in line with my child ordering ice cream for them and spending their money. And I think that's the best way to kind of say, you know, yeah, maybe. Or maybe a one year delay. But I think the closer we can get to closing that gap socially, emotionally in, like, plate situations, the better we're gonna have in an academic and other situation. So I do have another question. I got asked for us that I think we could lead into next time, which is kind of wisdom difference in having this personal plan in school on an IEP versus college. And I think that would try really nicely into kind of this whole discussion. We've had about seven advocacy that maybe we can build on for the next podcast. That sounds great. All right, well, thanks for joining us. You consider us a tweet @accesspractical. Thank you. And again, Happy birthday, Becky. I will not sing to you cause I like you too much. Thanks. Least So you're not singing